On Ret pallys

Get hit capped (8%)
Get expertise capped (25) - there's a glyph that gives you 10 expertise while using seal of vengeance, very useful if you're still in need of expertise, and you'll be using vengeance for bosses which are your main need for exp so it's all good.
once you've got those 2 capped your priority for gearing is:
#1 Strength
#2 Crit
#3 Attack Power - str is better but if you cant enchant for str go for AP.
#4ish Haste - this helps your sov, though you should avoid enchanting or gemming for it, much better to use those slots on crit or strength
And some people will claim you don't need armor pen, this isn't true, over 60% of your damage is done by just your regular old melee swing which armor pen effects, don't chase it over any of the above but don't avoid a piece of gear that's upping your str&crit just because it replaces haste with armor pen.

You don't have a rotation, you have a priority table for your attacks.
*Crusaders strike, this should be your first button to spam and should be used every time it's off cooldown.
*Exorcism, your second use, takes awhile to cooldown but it's a nice chunk of damage, especially against undead. However if your attacks haven't given you the buff for instant cast yet (requires talent) I'd suggest waiting on it till you do get the buff.
*Judgement should be 3rd on your list, usually you'll find you get to throwing judgement before you head back up to Crusader Strike.
*Divine Storm, quality damage, if you're in a group of more than 4 enemies bump this up to number 1 priority, number 2 if you've got a relic that gives you more str each time you do a crusader strike.
*Consecrate, it's not a lot of damage, definately low on your priority but every little bit helps, even in large groups I wouldnt suggest escalating this any higher up the priority list.
*Holy Wrath, if you're in a group of more than 4 undead put this right behind divine storm (roughly 3rd) on your priority, if they're not undead but still a large group pop this if nothing above is off cooldown yet (rare, but does happen)
*Hammer of Wrath, Only useable when they get low but definitely your highest average damage attack, when the enemy is low enough to use Hammer put it at #1 in your priority.

Like I said, this is a priority list, if something higher up on the list comes off cooldown use it before moving on. Also despite having only a couple buttons to press Ret pally's are really attention demanding, through my own experimentation I've seen my DPS fluctuate up to 1k depending on how on top of things I am.
Other suggestions, use Judgement of Wisdom as your judgement, ret pallys like to go oom and it's a good way of keeping yourself viable in a long fight without someone having to waste a mana regen ability on you.
Use vengeance for bosses/longfights, and either seal of Command or if you didnt spend the point on it, Seal of Righteousness for trash that dies quick.

That's all I got for you ret pallys, this is taken both from ret pallys on the WoW forums advice and my own experience. If anyone's got expanding or correcting for something I missed plz speak up!

Good guide - lets get some more ret pally opinions and discussion on this!

good job bruden - thank you for the time put in

Just trying to help, and I'd definitely love some more input from other experienced Ret pallys incase I missed something.

emiris, valrok, ohmygad.......I think he is directly talking to you and people like you.

QQ i should have made a pally. all that information is easily translated to roll face.

indeed - Helping out guildies with face rollin' capabilities = good

it really does translate to face roll, I don't even stop to think when I run across horde on my ret pally, I just jump at them and burn and about 95% of the time I slaughter them regardless of class/spec/gear. lol

Worthwhile in raids and heroics as well?

oh yeah, aside from the whole critting for 10k thing, if I'm on top of my game I can obliterate groups, and my real 4k+ dps shows up when focusing on a single boss. However if you're not on top of your game WOW can it get bad, I watched my dps flux between 2.5 and 4.2k the other day depending on how on top of my priority I was.

Yea I've noticed that with a lot of people! You have been doing steadily better with both toons though bruden from what I've seen. Keep it up! Especially on Bruden!

Stat priorities for retribution: Hit (to cap) > Expertise (to cap) = Strength > Crit Rating > Agility > Attack Power > Haste > Armor Penetration.

Hit Cap: 8% (263 hit rating), or 7% with a Draenei (around 230-231, I believe)
Expertise Cap: 26 (Glyph of Seal of Vengeance gives 10 expertise, so around 132-136 expertise rating)

Gems:
Unless you are a jewelcrafter, you should generally be using 4 gems: Relentless Earthsiege Diamond (Meta, 21 agi +3% crit damage), Bold Cardinal Ruby (+20 str), Inscribed Ametrine (10 str 10 crit), and Nightmare Tear (+10 all stats). If you are a jewelcrafter, you should be using three Bold Dragon's Eye (+34 strength) in your three best red sockets. If you wish, you can also use gems that give hit or expertise until you are hit and expertise capped.

Red: Bold Cardinal Ruby
Yellow: Inscribed Ametrine if the socket bonus gives at least 4 strength, otherwise Bold Cardinal Ruby
Blue: Nightmare Tear in your best blue socket (highest strength bonus), otherwise Bold Cardinal Ruby

If you don't have the gold (or don't want to use epic gems), the equivalent rare gems are also acceptable.

Glyphs:
Generally, you always want to be using the following three major glyphs:
Glyph of Judgement: +10% Judgement damage
Glyph of Consecration: +2 seconds on consecration cast and duration
Glyph of Seal of Vengeance: +10 expertise when using Seal of Vengeance

If you have 26 expertise without using the glyph, there are a couple of glyphs to choose from. Glyph of Exorcism (20% damage increase to exorcism) and Glyph of Seal of Righteousness (10% increased SoR damage) are your two best options.

Glyph of Sense Undead (+1% damage to undead while Sense Undead is active) is the only mandatory dps glyph. The other two are up to personal preference.

Enchants (budget alternatives in parenthesis):

Head: Arcanum of Torment [50 AP 20 crit]; Knights of the Ebon Blade Quartermaster
Shoulders: Greater Inscription of the Axe [24 AP 15 crit] (Lesser Inscription of the Axe [30 AP 10 crit]); Sons of Hodir Quartermaster
Back: 22 agility
Chest: +10 stats (+8 stats)
Wrist: 50 AP (38 AP), 15 expertise
Hands: 44 AP (35 AP), 15 expertise, 20 hit rating
Waist: Eternal Belt Buckle
Legs: Icescale Leg Armor [75 AP 22 crit] (Nerubian Leg Armor [55 AP 15 crit])
Feet: 32 AP, 12 crit/12 hit (24 AP)
Weapon: Berserking [400 AP on proc] (85 AP)

Librams:

There are only three librams you should consider at level 80. They are:
Deadly Gladiator's Libram of Fortitude (old AoE/trash seal)
Libram of Valiance (targets that live for >15 seconds; most boss fights)
Libram of Three Truths (new AoE/trash seal)



Rotation:
Retribution rotation is First Come, First Served (FCFS). Generally, hitting whatever spell is off cooldown will generate more DPS than waiting for a higher damage spell to come off cooldown (even if the wait is a few tenths of a second). Retribution rotation changes as your gear (and tier set bonuses) improve.

Basic starting Rotation:
Hammer of Wrath > Crusader Strike > Judgement > Divine Storm > Consecration > Exorcism > Holy Wrath (if undead/demon)

With better gear (generally around 2PT9):
Judgement > Hammer of Wrath > Crusader Strike > Divine Storm > Consecration > Exorcism > Holy Wrath (if undead/demon)

2PT9/2PT10:
Judgement > Divine Storm > Hammer of Wrath > Crusader Strike > Consecration > Exorcism > Holy Wrath (if undead/demon)

(will come back to later when I have more time and/or I remember)

hmm, I haven't tried upping judement to first priority, didn't think the t9 set bonus made enough difference. I'll give it a try, not sure on it though cause I've got the frost emblem sigil which gives big str bonus for every crusader strike. I'll give it a whirl and get back with results.

Other than that, good job catching a few things I missed! he's absolutely right about the gems, those are really all you need. As for enchants, I suggest +10 all stats to chest, agility to cloak, and attack power/crit/expertise to other slots as str is generally not available. Weapon enchants vary, I've been enjoying Beserking personally it's got a great proc chance and very nice effect, especially if you're aware enough to throw cooldowns in conjunction with it proccing on a boss.

Emiris is definitely right about it being first come first server for your attacks, which is why I called it priority rather than rotation, he however said it far better.

My rotation is different from Brudens and with mine u always have a spell up.

1.Crusader Strike
2.Judge
3.Divine Storm
4.Crusader Strike (It will be up)
5.Consecration
6.Exorcism
7.Crusader strike
8.Judge
9.Divine Plea or holy wrath (Your choice) i do divine plea first becuz i drop mana like a mofo
Rinse and repeat.

Basically you have to watch for what spell is up and if it use it unless a more powerful spell is up. kinda common sense.
And for your seals you should be using command when pulling trash or a boss you will not be straight up fighting for a while. (you have to move around and cant hit the boss for a couple secons.
Seal of Vengeance is for boss's that you can keep your 5 stacks up on if u have a responsibility on that boss and have to move and u lose your stack switch to command.

Also strength and crit is important we rely on on crit alot! thats how we got burstadins as a nickname. I have a 50% chance to crit and it rockz.

Thx, if u have any question reply or PM me in game.

bruden wrote:hmm, I haven't tried upping judement to first priority, didn't think the t9 set bonus made enough difference. I'll give it a try, not sure on it though cause I've got the frost emblem sigil which gives big str bonus for every crusader strike. I'll give it a whirl and get back with results.

Other than that, good job catching a few things I missed! he's absolutely right about the gems, those are really all you need. As for enchants, I suggest +10 all stats to chest, agility to cloak, and attack power/crit/expertise to other slots as str is generally not available. Weapon enchants vary, I've been enjoying Beserking personally it's got a great proc chance and very nice effect, especially if you're aware enough to throw cooldowns in conjunction with it proccing on a boss.

Emiris is definitely right about it being first come first server for your attacks, which is why I called it priority rather than rotation, he however said it far better.

Judgement to first priority really only works if you've been upgrading your gear evenly and not just a new 80 that bought 2PT9 first. I'm not sure exactly at what point Judgement > all in the rotation, just that, as you get better gear, it becomes your hardest hitting attack and is necessary to keep you from going OOM. IMO, You should only start using Judgment as first priority if you get the 4PT9 bonus or are geared in 226/232 up, sans the odd piece here and there (such as trinkets/cape).

Emiris wrote:

bruden wrote:hmm, I haven't tried upping judement to first priority, didn't think the t9 set bonus made enough difference. I'll give it a try, not sure on it though cause I've got the frost emblem sigil which gives big str bonus for every crusader strike. I'll give it a whirl and get back with results.

Other than that, good job catching a few things I missed! he's absolutely right about the gems, those are really all you need. As for enchants, I suggest +10 all stats to chest, agility to cloak, and attack power/crit/expertise to other slots as str is generally not available. Weapon enchants vary, I've been enjoying Beserking personally it's got a great proc chance and very nice effect, especially if you're aware enough to throw cooldowns in conjunction with it proccing on a boss.

Emiris is definitely right about it being first come first server for your attacks, which is why I called it priority rather than rotation, he however said it far better.

Judgement to first priority really only works if you've been upgrading your gear evenly and not just a new 80 that bought 2PT9 first. I'm not sure exactly at what point Judgement > all in the rotation, just that, as you get better gear, it becomes your hardest hitting attack and is necessary to keep you from going OOM. IMO, You should only start using Judgment as first priority if you get the 4PT9 bonus or are geared in 226/232 up, sans the odd piece here and there (such as trinkets/cape).

hmm, well I am in the realm of that gear setup, though I only have 3/5 t9. I've just never seen judgement hit that hard, where I've gotten 10k+ crusader strikes and divine storm crits my highest from judge is about 6k. It's definitely important for not going oom, and when I start to get in danger of that while chain pulling I often up it in priority till I get back to 1/2 mana, and ofcourse spam divine plea.

bruden wrote:

Emiris wrote:

bruden wrote:hmm, I haven't tried upping judement to first priority, didn't think the t9 set bonus made enough difference. I'll give it a try, not sure on it though cause I've got the frost emblem sigil which gives big str bonus for every crusader strike. I'll give it a whirl and get back with results.

Other than that, good job catching a few things I missed! he's absolutely right about the gems, those are really all you need. As for enchants, I suggest +10 all stats to chest, agility to cloak, and attack power/crit/expertise to other slots as str is generally not available. Weapon enchants vary, I've been enjoying Beserking personally it's got a great proc chance and very nice effect, especially if you're aware enough to throw cooldowns in conjunction with it proccing on a boss.

Emiris is definitely right about it being first come first server for your attacks, which is why I called it priority rather than rotation, he however said it far better.

Judgement to first priority really only works if you've been upgrading your gear evenly and not just a new 80 that bought 2PT9 first. I'm not sure exactly at what point Judgement > all in the rotation, just that, as you get better gear, it becomes your hardest hitting attack and is necessary to keep you from going OOM. IMO, You should only start using Judgment as first priority if you get the 4PT9 bonus or are geared in 226/232 up, sans the odd piece here and there (such as trinkets/cape).

hmm, well I am in the realm of that gear setup, though I only have 3/5 t9. I've just never seen judgement hit that hard, where I've gotten 10k+ crusader strikes and divine storm crits my highest from judge is about 6k. It's definitely important for not going oom, and when I start to get in danger of that while chain pulling I often up it in priority till I get back to 1/2 mana, and ofcourse spam divine plea.

Self buffed, my judgment hits harder than divine storm or crusader strike (with five stacks of SoV and including the SoV proc damage into DS/CS). On top of that, paladins have a talent that gives 18% additional critical strike chance for judgment, and the 4PT9 bonus gives an additional 5% critical strike chance. Modeling your paladin in Rawr under default buffs (all raid buffs), placing judgment as first priority results in a 70-100 DPS increase over placing it where it would otherwise normally be.